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Bluffers guide to flat taxes (Read 30015 times)
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Bluffers guide to flat taxes
Feb 18th, 2012 at 5:40am
Mark & Quote Quote 
A number of articles from around the web about Flat Taxes in the UK, in one handy place for further reference....

Steve Baker MP on Flat Taxes (ConservativeHome)

Edward Leigh on Flat Taxes (ConservativeHome)

Roger Helmer MEP on Flat Taxes (Tax Payer's Alliance)
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Re: Bluffers guide to flat taxes
Reply #1 - Sep 20th, 2012 at 8:04pm
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Progressive Taxation (John Redwood's Diary)
Quote:
Some of you suggest a flat tax. This is still a tax which taxes the rich considerably more than the poor. If person A is on £20,000 a year, and the flat tax is 20% with the first £10,000 of income tax free, they pay just £2000 of tax, or 10%.  Someone on £100,000 of income pays £18,000, or nine times the amount of the person on the lower income, at 18%.  When Mr Osborne said he liked flat taxes, it still left him supporting the general notion that that the rich should pay a lot more than those on low incomes.
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Re: Bluffers guide to flat taxes
Reply #2 - Sep 20th, 2012 at 8:08pm
Mark & Quote Quote 
JP Floru: f.a.o. George Osborne: Hong Kong’s HK $71.3 billion budget surplus
Quote:
The rebate comes on top of already very low existing taxes. Corporations pay a flat tax of 16.5%.  Individuals pay a salaries tax which is stepped from 2 to 17%, with numerous deductions (mortgages, charitable giving, education, pensions, care of elderly relatives). But the total is topped to 15%, meaning that one can choose to pay whatever is the lowest. Because of the deductions most employees pay little or no tax. The top 2% choose the top 15% rate – they account for half of all revenue from the salaries tax.

Quote:
Hong Kong is prime evidence to show that low taxes increase the size of the economy; thereby ultimately making the total tax take grow. The UK could do this too. It chooses not to, thereby encouraging individuals and businesses to flee to places like Hong Kong. It is very odd: one would have assumed that the Coalition Government wanted to receive more money, not less.
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Re: Bluffers guide to flat taxes
Reply #3 - Nov 1st, 2012 at 5:53pm
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Related: in the video section, dating back to April 2011 - World's fastest speaker vs the UK Tax Code

Daily MaiL, September 2011: Rip up tax rules and start from scratch, say top economists

ConservativeHome, September 2012: Alex Deane: A vitally important speech by David Davis
Quote:
Whenever you increase a tax rate you can be sure that you will collect less tax than you expect. Why? Because people will do less of the activity that you are taxing.


Daily Telegraph, 30th October 2012: Our tax system is a chain around the economy’s ankles

CLICK HERE to search for articles on Tax at AlltheInterweb.
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« Last Edit: Nov 1st, 2012 at 5:57pm by Admin-JD »  
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Re: Bluffers guide to flat taxes
Reply #4 - Oct 7th, 2013 at 4:25pm
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Middle-class families are paying a 73% top tax rate and losing on average £1,300 a year
Quote:
* Under a pure flat tax everyone would pay the same rate

* Experts say middle-class families are effectively paying more than someone on £150,000 might pay

* Families where one or two partners earn £50,000 to £60,000 have lost all or most of their child benefit


Quote:
Britain should introduce a ‘flat tax’ system to stop middle-class families from paying punitive rates, a leading business representative said yesterday.

The withdrawal of child benefit means that a single earner paid between £50,000 and £60,000 in a family with four children is hit with a ‘marginal tax rate’ of 73 per cent, according to experts.

This top rate of tax is worked out by treating the loss of child benefit as though it was a tax. Affected families have lost an average of £1,300 per year.

Simon Walker, director general of the Institute of Directors, said that high marginal tax rates ‘degrade the motivation to work’ for many.

‘This is a huge disincentive as it is for beneficiaries on the lowest wages – some of them can be paying 70 per cent, 75 per cent,’ he told the Murnaghan Show on Sky News.



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Re: Bluffers guide to flat taxes
Reply #5 - Oct 8th, 2013 at 4:43pm
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A single income tax would simplify our excessively convoluted system
Quote:
TAX simplification is back on the agenda, thanks to Simon Walker, director general of the Institute of Directors. Highlighting combined marginal rates of child benefit withdrawal and income tax of 73 per cent for those with four children earning between £50,000 and £60,000 a year, Walker called for radically simpler taxes. “I am all for a flat simple tax system,” he said, adding, “it has been shown to raise a lot more money”.

He is right. Low, simple taxes stimulate economic activity and growth. It’s not just that when people get to keep more of the money they earn they are more motivated. It’s also that when taxes are easy to understand and simple to administrate, people and companies aren’t put off by the unknown quantity of what the tax implications might be for a job or project. And they don’t divert their best minds from determining how to produce better products and services, to working out how to navigate taxes.

Sadly, that’s exactly what happens at present. Income is taxed differently depending on whether it’s in the form of earnings, dividends or interest. Earnings are also subject to another two income taxes in the form of national insurance – one paid by the employee and another by the employer. And, just to make sure it’s not too easy to understand, these are levied per job and weekly, rather than per person and annually
Read more...
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Re: Bluffers guide to flat taxes
Reply #6 - Oct 8th, 2013 at 5:01pm
Mark & Quote Quote 
Some examples of typical arguments from lefties who don't read things properly & can't do maths... borrowed from here

Me: Quote:
Raise threshold people have to pay income tax to £12,000 & introduce a flat rate of 30% income tax on money earned over that.


Leftie Labourite from Manchester area: Quote:
a flat rate 30 % income tax on anything over 12 grand so your telling me your going to hit young familys and working familys who are struggling in say 15/20 k a year hard and give people earning 50/60/70 k and more a tax break.........some great ideas on here but this is the worst yet!!


Me: Quote:
The first £12,000 would be free from tax... anything over that say £12,001 would only have tax payable on the £1 that put it over = 30p
So someone on £15,000 would get £12,000 free from tax, and the remaining £3,000 would have about £900 income tax due on it.... this always seems to catch out lefties whenever someone brings up the subject of Flat Taxes.
30%'s a bargain.... think the UKIP lot were saying they wanted to bring in a similar idea if they ever get in but with a 35% flat tax (and anything under a certain amount tax free, and only pay income tax on the money earned after that)..... and it cuts down on people earning lots of money trying to skive out of it by paying fancy accountants 'cos it's cheaper just to pay what they owe.

Something out last year said introducing such a flat tax @ 30% would make an average 2-earner household £3,400 better off.
[url=]http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...economy.html[/url]


Leftie Labourite from Manchester area: Quote:
i just cant see it you are hammering working class familys earning between 12 and 32 thousand with a woping tax increase taking lots more money off people that need it and ie footballers or bankers who are paid fortunes you are filling there pockets with thousands more it makes no sense at all.........i dont read the mail they are a bunch of muppets


Me: Quote:
Not technically.... currently (or due to be soon) it's about £10,000 before people start having pay income tax, this would allow them to earn another £2,000 before they have to pay income tax.
Min. wage = £6 an hour(ish), £6 x 40hrs a week = £240 x 52 weeks in a a year = £12,480
With that flat tax idea idea they'd get an extra £2,000 free of tax, and only pay income tax on the £480 = £144

+ people like Tony Blair who earn £12million a year but use expensive accountants to find enough tax loopholes to end up only paying £315,000 tax on it wouldn't be able to wriggle out of it like that and have to cough-up £3,600,000 in tax whether they liked it or not.


Leftie Labourite from Manchester area: Quote:
You can come up with fig but the fact is i earned about 46 k last year....the first 10 was tax free the next 33 is 20 % and the rest is 40 % and there is alot on around my pay with familys and you would sting us for 3 grand more tax so i say again your hammering low to middle class earners


Me: Quote:
So you'd rather have someone on £12,480 a year minimum wage pay £496 in income tax @ 20% on the £2,480 they earn after the current £10,000 income tax threshold than have them pay £144 in income tax @ 30% on the £480 earned over a £12,000 income tax threshold?


Leftie Labourite from Manchester area: Quote:
Yes they would be better off at first but say they did loads of overtime to...
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Re: Bluffers guide to flat taxes
Reply #7 - Dec 11th, 2013 at 5:28pm
Mark & Quote Quote 
Flat Tax system...... £46,000 - £12,000 = £34,000 after tax free allowance = £10,200 income tax payable.
£23,800 leftover + £12,000 tax free allowance = £35,800

Current tax system (bit more complicated to work out)
£46,000 - £10,000 = £36,000 taxable
£33,000 payable @ 20% = £6,600
£3,000 payable @ 40% = £1,200
Total tax paid = £7,800
Money leftover after tax =
£28,200 + £10,000 allowance = £38,200

Difference between Flat Tax (as I proposed) & Now = £2,400
But it could probably be balanced out by lowering VAT back down to it's previously more familiar 17.5% + scrap / lower various Stealth Taxes left behind by Labour under Gormless Gordon + reigning in excessive fuel taxes.

+ the simpler way of working it out would cut down on cock-ups and avoidance, leaving the HMRC free to chase-up Tax Evaders
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Re: Bluffers guide to flat taxes
Reply #8 - Dec 11th, 2013 at 9:02pm
Mark & Quote Quote 
OK, spot the deliberate(?) cock-up I made with the above calculations which kinda slipped my mind. Corrections highlighted in
red


Quote:
Flat Tax system...... £46,000 - £12,000 = £34,000 after tax free allowance = £10,200 income tax payable @ 30%.
National Insurance contributions = £0 (merged with Income tax)

£23,800 leftover + £12,000 tax free allowance = £35,800


Quote:
Current tax system (bit more complicated to work out)
£46,000 - £10,000 = £36,000 taxable
£33,000 payable @ 20% = £6,600
£3,000 payable @ 40% = £1,200
Total
Income
tax paid = £7,800
Money leftover after
Income
tax =
£28,200 + £10,000 allowance = £38,200

National Insurance due = c. £4,134
Money leftover after NI = £34,066


Corrections to rough calculations provided by the online calculator here: http://www.listentotaxman.com/

Provided by someone in a reply to this:
https://www.facebook.com/PoliticsUK/posts/696085147091194
(dominated by the usual lefty prats claiming we should raise the top rate of tax to 50 - 80%, as opposed to Cameron's aim in the story being commented on of dropping it from 45% to 40%).
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« Last Edit: Dec 11th, 2013 at 9:13pm by Admin-JD »  
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